5 4 6 A P P E N D I X G
to what he attributes the mysterious fascination that his theory generates, also outside the
select scientific circle, and what he thinks accounts for the enthusiasm of even the general
public that pulsates around him and almost makes him a new popular idol.
— Two principal motives — he tells me — contribute to producing all this international
clamor about my theory. The first is that, in the theory of relativity, one sees a certain
something that takes one away from human life, from this human life of today that is so
tumultuous, problematic, so full of innumerable crises, of social transitions and unexpected
morals. There is a diffuse and confused need in the world to somehow come out of the chaos
left by the war, to take off the muddied and bloody clothing in which we all found ourselves
dressed, to break free of ourselves. And the second motive is this, in my opinion: that the
important evolutions in thinking, those that are or come to be seen as great innovations and
spiritual advances, have always come, almost miraculously, at the most politically and
socially agitated moments.
— Do you think that your theory, translated into philosophical, moral, political, practical
terms, can and should have an influence on the most pressing problems that we are facing
today; that it can hasten the transformation of the world which we sense with dark antici-
pation, and that, according to some, we are even suffering under already; that it can precip-
itate or resolve the crisis of our civilization?
— My theory — responds Einstein — has no intention of this sort, at least not in my
mind. I have absolutely nothing to do with the applications people are making up for it, or
with the illusions they are deriving from it, also in Italy. They say that my doctrine is anti-
rationalist, while I think I am a perfect rationalist. I have directly followed the rationalistic
line; I have not broken it, as some claim. I build on Newton, I do not annul him. So, only
through misinterpretation can my theory have a poetic significance, leading, without my
intention or my authority, to misunderstandings that are construed around it and to which it
is forced to conform. Let us no longer talk of the political concerns or principles that some
would like to connect to it. Since it is well-known that I am a pacifist, an internationalist, a
Jew, people have said and say that my doctrine is essentially revolutionary and socially
dangerous. I maintain that, since I have done nothing revolutionary in the field of science,
because I draw consistently from the past, I am also not a revolutionary in the socio-politi-
cal field, in which I am not even involved, and while I respond to the legitimate doubts and
the strictly scientific questions that my studies can raise, I refuse to argue about my suppos-
edly practical revolutionary doctrine.
The allusion to German polemics and to pacifism encourages me to speak with Einstein
about the war and about peace.
— I believe in peace — states Einstein, with his slow quietness but with a glow in his
great, tired, dream-filled eyes — because peace must and will be. Not because technical
discoveries, ever more horrific, will make it impossible. From this point of view, we have
been able to verify that, in spite of so many hopes and illusions, war will always be possible.
The world does not seem to fear even the most extreme and catastrophic inhumanity and
murderousness of war. Rather, we have had to convince ourselves, and we will convince
ourselves even more, that war is not economically profitable and, for this reason, is
economically impossible. We begin to understand, finally, that all of us together have an
interest in war not happening again. We depend, in this area, even more stringently on one
another and war, instead of benefiting one side or the other, only serves to render everyone

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A C O N V E R S AT I O N W I T H E I N S T E I N 5 4 5
ebraica di Gerusalemme. Il sionismo è una grande cosa e potrà essere, nella mia speranza
io me ne lusingo, un grande movimento di spiriti, se non di genti. È probabile che le correnti
emigratorie ebraiche possano trovare in Palestia una sede stabile, prospera e tranquilla
quantunque sia evidente che la Palestina non potrà accogliere tutte. Ma per me è più impor-
tante che la Palestina divenga un centro culturale e ideale, che un centro nazionale.
Gli ebrei hanno bisogno di avere un centro di cultura cui affissarci e in cui esaltare le
loro peculiarità di coscienza e di fede. No, io non credo possibile e nobile l’assimilazione
ebraica, là dove essa è a proprio incompatibile con la più semplice e modesta dignità uma-
na. Possiamo assimilarci a parità di condizioni, dove l’elemento ebraico è rispettato, dove
la intelligenza ebraica può fiorire senza subire oltraggi e costrizioni, dove lo spirito pecu-
liare nazionale non è posto a bando dalla libera e armonica convivenza delle nazionalità;
ma dove l’antisemitismo impera, assimilazione vorrebbe dire umiliazione e perdizione, as-
senso vile e smarrimento. Io non credo all’ “elezione”, alla superiorità ebraica, ma sento
che l’Ebraismo deve avere una sua dignità, una sua coscienza e partecipare ad una parità
onesta di condizioni di vita e di cultura. Il Sionismo serve a dare una coscienza e una dignità
agli Ebrei, serve a fare in modo che essi non si annullino. Gli ebrei non devono essere su-
periori e non sono superiori, ma devono essere.
Questo mi induce a ripetere ad Einstein che egli passa per essere uno dei supremi e più
squisiti fiori della razza; ma egli si schermisce con uno dei suoi sorrisi più bonari e uno dei
suoi gesti più fanciulleschi:
— Tutto quello che ho fatto e pensato è così semplice, non è nulla . . . — e riprende,
alzandosi, quella sua aria di grande fanciullo trasognato e lontano, quasi sospeso e oscillan-
te nel moto del suo sogno.
TRANSLATION
A CONVERSATION
WITH
ALBERT EINSTEIN
Tall, robust, of an almost Balzacian physique, but with a pale face of the most pure and
sweet Oriental pallor and with two deep, thoughtful and melancholy eyes whose pupils
seem to reflect all of the spiritual defeats and ascents of past Jewish generations that sur-
vived the exhausting tumult of martyrdom and anxiety, Albert Einstein, before leaving to
give the first part of his lecture on the theory of relativity at the ancient Bolognese Studio,
answered my questions with tired and kindly attention.
We continue a conversation begun yesterday evening in a very hospitable home and this
morning the professor is more free to talk, released from the bonds of admiration and curi-
osity pestering him for long hours, and speaks with his studious and slow Italian, unraveling
his thoughts, almost distilling and savoring them, from the novel words. Speaking is not
Einstein’s strength—he confesses that—not even in German. He deplores not having the
gift of expressivity. He attributes to himself many of the misinterpretations of his theory that
have occurred and still occur in the world, to his deficiency in communication. But, on the
other hand, he does not admit that his theory is more abstruse than other scientific theories.
I have promised him not to enter into strictly scientific and technical areas so as not to
run the risk that I, too, misrepresent him, but I cannot completely resist at least asking him

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A C O N V E R S AT I O N W I T H E I N S T E I N 5 4 7
barren in the same way and to isolate us in terrible misery. War was profitable, and war was
possible while the regime of slavery was in force and the victor could effectively occupy
the enemy soil and literally destroy the population. With the abolition of slavery war has
been rendered useless and so should not only seem impossible but inconceivable. Regard-
ing economic disasters, a Dutch friend of mine was telling me that the Dutch colonies have
produced and are producing one of the most exquisite teas ever sold in all the world. Today
the Dutch, because of the great catastrophe driven by the exchange rates, can no longer sell
this tea and use it as fertilizer. Multiply this example by another one hundred thousand
similar examples and we will have the horrible picture of the unsolvability of war.
— Are they beginning to understand that in Germany?
— Yes, they are beginning to. Germany is now starting to study economics and politics.
In politics, it is like the young girl who is opening up herself to an understanding of life and
love. But if there still persists, in certain German classes and castes, I will not say the old
pan-Germanism but an exasperated and sad nationalism, a nationalism not as yet resigned,
this is due first of all to the Treaty of Versailles, then to the continuous series of ultimatums,
decrees, verdicts that the Allies repeatedly impose by virtue of the Treaty and that irritate
the wound and rekindle nationalistic sentiments. The Treaty of Versailles could be cruel,
but . . . up to a certain point. I believe that at least it could have been less cruel. You can
operate on a patient, but you must operate only once and then you must leave him alone, or
else he gets worse all over again. Peace is threatened in Germany by the “continuous in-
sults” that the Allies can deliver at any moment, on any occasion. The partition of territo-
ries, especially in eastern Prussia, has been one of these continuing insults that I deplore the
most, precisely because I believe it is the most harmful to the cause of peace.
— And the internal peace in Germany? There are those who believe that the economic
and monetary crisis will lead to a new revolution . . .
— I do not believe that is possible. The country works as much as it can, as much as the
Allies allow it to work. The working classes have a very difficult time, but are calm. For
example, I think the idea of a Bolshevik experiment should be excluded. Where they have
had a Bolshevik experiment, like in Bavaria, the foolish reactionary ambitions have again
become prevalent. If it were possible to think of internal movements, I would more likely
accept the possibility of a reactionary movement, Kappist, than a Bolshevik movement. Re-
member that Germany has a sense, by now, of the possibilities, understands, by now, what
is achievable and what is not. I repeat again that, also from the international point of view,
the Germans would gradually orient themselves towards an absolute and imperative idea of
peace if, almost every day, an act of the Allies did not push them up against the wall of their
offended nationalism. There are sanctions and pressures in the Peace Treaty which, as was
even told confidentially by someone who participates in the international councils of the
Allies, end up being either inapplicable or damaging to the Allies themselves. The political
leaders and the public at large need to gain even greater consciousness of the impossibility
and the inapplicability of certain provisions and to spread this knowledge throughout the
world by every means.
— You support it, don’t you, the Association of the League of Nations?
— I support it completely without subscribing to any organization. And on this matter I
do not hide my thoughts. It is necessary to make propaganda for immediate pacification and
for definitive peace. I do not wish to talk about the plans that should be devised in case of

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